Tantric meat
(By Tsem Rinpoche)
As a Vajrayana practitioner, do you not partake of meat at vajra feasts? I am a great admirer of the late Kalu Rinpoche. Now in Sukumvati. He was very clear on this subject. On page 124-125 in his book, “Foundations of Tibetan Buddhism”,… he goes through the root Vajrayana downfalls. Let me please share downfall #13: “The thirteen root downfall concerns our attitude and approach to tantric practice and tantric ritual. If we are participating in a ganachakra or vajra feast, where ritual use of meat and alcohol is made, and we abstain from one of the other of these on the grounds that it is impure or that it is contrary to our convictions and principles, then we have failed to appreciate the view of tantra which attempts to transcend purity and impurity, attempts to transcend dualistic thinking, and we have failed to appreciate and take part in the spirit of that tantric transformation process. To indulge in this kind of superficial, dualistic clinging to appearances during the course of a tantric ritual is to commit the 13th root downfall and to go against the spirit of our tantric practice.”–(from a facebook comments post)
During tantric rituals, a tiny bit of meat, must be had for the greater view and greater good..which is to overcome clinging…but what I am talking about is daily consumption of meat…steaks, fried chicken, pork chops, leg of lamb, turtle soup, sharksfin, duck, rabbit stew, frog legs, clams, seafood chowder, sushi, and all the other animals slaughtered daily for our taste buds…. If we give up all meat eating and meat consumption then let’s talk about tsok meat. HH Kyabje Zong Rinpoche mentioned in Los Angeles, we can take some tsampa and put a few drops of alcohol on it in place of meat when we cannot get it for tsok…..that can be used for meat. In Tibet Kyabje Zong Rinpoche would do that. Tsem Rinpoche
Please support us so that we can continue to bring you more Dharma:
If you are in the United States, please note that your offerings and contributions are tax deductible. ~ the tsemrinpoche.com blog team
Reminds me where in A Cascading Waterfall of Nectar where Thinley Norbu Rinpoche says if you don’t have medication you can take amrita dharma medicine blessed by a wisdom realized lama.
Vaishnavas and Jains I think are very strict vegetarians.
Dear Rinpoche, more than 3000 animals die in a second around the world and half of them are meant for food. Every single animal and human also have a heart, us humans are in a higher realm but that reason alone doesn’t give us permission to have right to consume animals.
This explanation, I have heard many times when people would say, why are things so contradicting in Buddhism?
One moment you tell me not to eat meat and the next you say eating meat is good and infact used in tantric practices?
I think this thinking is not wrong, but is due to their ignorance.
Let me give you an example. When we were 12 years old, our parents and the law will prohibit us from driving a car because obviously it is too dangerous for a 12 year old to handle… but when we reach 18, our parents will happily send us to driving school to get our driving license.
The same with this case. At our present level, being vegetarian will benefit us spiritually rather than taking meat. And when we reach to a higher level of thinking, then we will have to take some meat during Tsog because that would be beneficial for our spiritual practice.
Many times people get too righteous about not eating meat, I believe when you are a great practitioner, what you will be developing is to remove this view of ‘vegetarianism is pure, while eating meat is not’… I think this is the purpose of tantric meat.
Amazing, I really found this article quite interesting. Its good to eat a little bit of meat to prevent killing, Its better than a daily consumption of meat. That kills so many lives. Thank you for sharing this with us Rinpoche.
Here is a wonderful teaching given by His Holiness the 17th Karmapa on vegetarianism. http://www.rinpoche.com/teachings/nomeat.htm?page_id=52
Dear Sir,
i want to learn tara pooja n all, will u suggest me proper path.
thanks / regards
Dear Chandra, it is wonderful to do Tara Puja. Contact Shin at E-division to find out more in Kechara. Thanks. TR
Dear Chandra,
Please contact me at shin@tsemladrang.com.
Thank you.
Shin
In everything we do, there is positive and negative effects due to the nature of our existence. It is 100% correct you don’t eat meat. HH the Dalai Lama, the highest authority within Tibetan Buddhism recommends we do not eat meat, so that is all we need to remember. Buddha said, we should not lie, or get attached to drinking, singing, dancing, intimacies,entertainments and that we should spend our energies to become enlightened. Are we doing all die and not just the meat part?? People tend to pick what is convenient from the Buddha’s teachings to suit themselves. If we are going to follow Buddha’s teachings or quote, we may ask are you following everything Buddha says? If you are not, then rejoice when others follow the best they can and as much as they can. Since it is the right path for 21st century Buddhists to follow the no meat path, let’s do it. We have so much variety of food. Let’s eat the no meat diet and get on with our practice and basically compassionately go passed the criticisms. It is very simple, do not kill. So hence animals will not die in front of you to eat them…There is no good karma in eating meat..full stop, but definitely there is good karma refraining from eat. Many of the tantras when engaged in the practice prohibit meat as taught by Vajradhara. Many rituals we do in the great Monasteries prohibit meat so the rituals are more effective…..Many who are not monks or not living in the monasteries would never understand that. Reading from books, net or from dharma centres would never be the same as in the monastery. Again, eating meat does not gather good merits for our spiritual practice, avoiding does. Listen to some of wonderful Tenzin Palmo’s views on not eating meat. She is the great yogini who meditated for the longest time in the mountains.TR
In the tantras such as Tara, White Tara, Vajrapani, Manjushri, Saraswati, Tsongkapa, Dukkar, Avalokitesvara, Oserchenma, Maitreya, etc, it is highly recommended you do not eat meat/eggs when you engage in their sadhanas, practice, retreats. When you do Tara Pujas (Drolchok), you are suppose to avoid meat or you shouldn’t engage in the pujas. In the Monastery, countless times we have to do Tara puja or engage monks to do for us, they have to avoid meat before coming..it was strict. If you are doing Naga pujas, you have to avoid meat and it is a must. There are many types of beneficial naga pujas such as Lutor, Lusang, etc that you avoid meat totally. There’s a very powerful Naga vase (Lubum), which my guru made and I have one for years now, and it is specifically for generating wealth for dharma activities. If you keep this vase, make proper offerings, then with the motivation of dharma, your financial resources will increase to fund the dharma works. 10 years ago, when I was literally down to a few dollars and struggled financially very badly, I called my Guru for divination, he said to get a Naga vase and then with some time it will be ok. He taught me how to make offerings and what to offer and not offer and one big no-no is meat. He said avoid meat…or in my thinking no wealth…LOL. Well I didn’t offer meat, after that yearly I can see growth in Kechara.So no meat in this case was worth it for growth to benefit others.
Eating meat ordinarily as a diet is definitely wrong for Tantric practitioners. One must not see things as it is and come to a conclusion. In a Ritual in Tantra unless you have taken the Initiation you will not be able to understand the workings of why tasting a little meat is not prohibited. that is why it is called “Secret Tantra” practice and the meanings and interpretation connected to the Ritual. Before one can go into the Secret Practice one has to know the basis and knowledge of Buddhism well in the Sutra then only you go into Tantra. Its just like when you go to Kindagarden first then step by step into University.
Anila,
Thank you for taking the time to add to Rinpoche’s answer. I went to a Losar celebration last weekend and at one point we were all given a shred of beef jerky. I found it a little confusing because all this is new to me.
Sincerely,
Jessi
Dear Rinpoche,
I am new to Buddhism and have a question regarding this topic. Does one have to eat meat in higher tantric practices? Please help me to understand why this is necessary or if it is even necessary at all.
Thank you.
Sincerely,
Jessi Bryant
In all of Buddhism you should not eat meat. All the more so in higher forms of Buddhism.
Good. That’s all I need to know. I’m much happier as a vegetarian. Thank you Rinpoche, for taking the time to answer my question.
Dear Rinpoche
I have to admit that I am not a full fledge vegetarian…however, I do subscribe to the compassionate reasons for meat-less diet, and constantly striving towards becoming a full vegan.
While sharing “If Slaughterhouses Had Glass Walls”, a friend of mine raises the following question which I am afraid I have not enough wisdom to answer. Maybe your eminence could help shed some light over this topic?
“To plant more vegetables would lead to cultivation of more land, using of more pesticides which could also harm or destroy living beings in the process, and maybe more in terms of numbers.
If killing those tiny beings are not equal to killing animals, for instance, are we having discrimination of them? If they are equal, however, shouldn’t we refrain from eating too much vegetables also?”
Your kind explanation is very much appreciated.
Warm regards
Charles
Dear Charles, any action in samsara will create some sort of negative karma. We cannot avoid it. That is the key, we cannot avoid it. Contaminated karma always results in contaminated situations to experience. Hence, the key is to not bust our heads finding a karma-less way, but what’s less. Less negative karma is the key. I eat organic vegetables as much as possible.
So eating meat while we question pesticides is great, it means you are thinking..but eating more meat doesn’t solve the problems either.
Tsem Rinpoche
Hi Charles,
It takes more plants to feed an animal till its big enough to eat for one meal for a person than it takes plants to make a person one meal, if a chicken is six weeks old when its chopped up into nuggets its had six weeks worth of grain etc. I expect with cows and pigs would be even more so.
One of my customers kills male goats at birth because it cost more to grow them into food sized animals than they are worth, about £18 i think…..
Sorry to have hijacked your question.
With care,
Jon
My ignorance on this subject is profound, but if killing is not ok, I don’t understand how eating meat is ok.
Dear David, what you wrote is simple short yet very profound. Thank you so much. Tsem R